John Gedda Interview

John Gedda Interview

Transcript at 0 seconds: (00:00)

RUSSELL MAGNAGHI (RM): Hancock, Michigan. February 18th, 1983. Okay, John, could you tell us--go back to your father coming over here. Could you give us his name and where he was from in Italy?

JOHN GEDDA (JG): Well, I know from he came from the old country, but actually I don't know what part. See, any of that, too much about that, they never talked too much about it, not when us…we were…kids were around, see. But I know--I don't know what year he came over in. I don't know. That I couldn't tell you, see.

RM: But he settled here in Hancock.

JG: Yeah, but he settled here in Hancock. Yeah.

RM: And then, what did he… What occupation did he get into? Was he a miner?

JG: Well, now whether he worked in a mine, that I couldn't tell you, see. Maybe… He probably did for a couple of years, and then I think he went to work for the Marta Bakery [phonetic spelling] up there. He worked there for how long, how many years, I don't know, see. But then when he went to work for Marta Bakery, he bought this here macaroni spaghetti business from Campioni [phonetic spelling], and he set it up here, see, and then he went into the bakery business.

Transcript at 1 minute and 14 seconds: (1:14)

RM: So, for a while then. For about how long was he in the spaghetti business?

JG: That—now, I couldn't tell you, and I really don't know, but I don't think he…

RM: Were you born then?

JG: I don’t think he was in too long, no. I don't think. I don't think I was born.

RM: When were you born?

JG: I was born in 1917, see, ‘cause that's--the time I was born, he had that bakery business already, see.

RM: So, do you think maybe he went out of the macaroni business because it wasn't [phone rings] that wasn’t too popular?

JG: That… Now, that… Now, I couldn't tell. Maybe he didn't like it, see.

RM: Yeah.

JG: So.

RM: Okay, now about when did he get into the bakery business then?

JG: Well, I don't know. Probably maybe it could be in the year 1900 or something, see, because I know it was…it was around there early in 1900s, see. Probably could have been in before, see, because they never discussed it too much with us kids, you know what I mean?

Transcript at 2 minutes and 13 seconds: (2:13)

RM: Yeah. Now, what did he do then? He--what types of bread did he make?

JG: Well, at that time, that's all he used to make was just Italian bread. You know what I mean? From high (??) rolls, and then he used to like--he used to make those breadsticks, and those are (??) chips. See, now whether he made some of them or not, I don't know. He could have made it in those days ‘cause there was a lot of Italian people around, see.

RM: Now, did he deliver?

JG: Yeah, he used to have some men working for him, a couple of men working for him. He used to go out and deliver. That's when he used to go out with the horse and the sleigh in the winter, see. Then in the summer, they had the wagon.

RM: Now, would they deliver the bread warm?

JG: [laughs] Maybe in the summer, but not in the winter, ‘cause by the time the people got it, it was frozen… [laughs] in those days.

Unidentified Male Speaker (UMS): Well, I remember when Madeline [phonetic spelling] used to bring it to our house. It used to be… You know, it was still warm.

JG: It was still warm then when she would… Then that's when he used to make it in the night, see, and they used to work in the night. Well, then they used to go out and deliver maybe about 10 o'clock in the morning and bread was coming out of the oven. But before that, well, it was a different story, see. You know.

Transcript at 3 minutes and 34 seconds: (03:34)

RM: Now during that time when your father had the bakery there, in the early years, was there a large Italian population in Hancock?

JG: Yeah, there was quite a few between here, up in the Calumet, Baltics, out range, and then there used to be--there was more than one Italian bakery then. There was us. There was Marder (??) up there. Then, there used to be Brocco (??). Then, there used to be Trianno’s (??). Then, there used to be another one up there in South Range. Well, then there was--the population was big in those days, and the mines were working good. You remember when the mines were going full blast then?

RM: Now, did the--were you the only bakery there in this area?

JG: Since when?

RM: I mean, the only Italian bakery?

JG: Well, in the last few years, yeah.

RM: But how about in...

JG: In this area here, in Hancock here? I think—well, I think we had… Between Hancock and Houghton, I think we were the only one. Then, like I say, there was one up in South Range, and then there was about three up in that--between Calumet and Laurium. There were other bakers, but they were all different nationalities.

Transcript at 4 minutes and 45 seconds: (04:45)

RM: Now, what would, say, be the--your schedule in terms of making bread? What time of the day would you start making it?

JG: Well now, you're referring to me or to my dad?

RM: Well, your dad.

JG: Well, he used to work--they used to work night shift, I think, mostly. Mostly all night shifts. See, they used to--unless they used to make a sponge, what they call a sponge. They'd make it, and it's probably for about four or five hours, and they'd mix their dough up with that, see.

RM: And how did—

JG: And then it was all hand work. They probably had a machine out in those days, but there's not too many models for the small bakers. So when they had mixed the doughs by hand, they used to have big wooden troughs, and there used to be two guys, they'd get in there with their hands and keep on turning the dough over. [laughs]

RM: Now, how long would something like that take to do?

JG: You mean from start to finish?

RM: Yeah.

JG: Well, now that varies. That all depends how much bread they had to handle, see. But I'd probably… I’d say it'd probably take about a good eight, ten hours at least anyways.

RM: From the time you—

JG: And then it all depends on the capacity, what your oven would hold, how many loaves. See, the more your oven holds, well, the sooner you get through.

RM: So, it would take that long then, say for an average...

JG: Yeah. So probably maybe an oven about this size, you can see that's really an old-timer, see. There's the firebox right on the side there where they used to burn the wood. They never had no temperature regulator or nothing. Inside, it was all bricks. And when those bricks got a certain—like, white hot--then they figured it was hot enough. Then, they'd take a big long stick with some rags on it, they'd wet it, and then they'd get in there and mop it up, see, take all--if there were any ashes or cinders in there. Because the firebox was built there and the chimney was over here, so when they made the fire, well, the flames used to go right through the whole oven. See, that's why.

RM: Oh, I see.

JG: That's why when they were baking bread, they couldn't have no fire going. Otherwise, they'd burn everything, see. So when they figured the oven was hot enough, they'd bank the fire, let it go down. But hell, those ovens there were made out of all bricks and stone, and, you know, when that gets hot, it stays hot for a hell of a long time. You can bake as much as five, six hundred loaves, see. And then in the end--well, he used to make a few cakes too in the end, but he never frosted them, see. So by the time he got through baking all his bread, well, then the oven was just the right temperature for cakes.

RM: I see.

JG: Or sweet stuff or whatever you want to bake, see.

Transcript at 7 minutes and 27 seconds: (7:27)

RM: Now with these ovens, were these some kind of an Italian construction and made by, constructed by Italians?

JG: Well, now that I wouldn’t say, because I think when he moved here, I think there was… He… There was somebody with a shop here before, and he bought it from them.

RM: I see.

JG: He bought the whole set-up.

RM: Mm-hm. Mm-hm. Now, like we were talking about, say, an average amount of bread, how much bread would you say he'd make?

JG: In those days when he was working by himself, now, I couldn't exactly tell you.

RM: But he'd be making several hundred loaves.

JG: Probably in those days, I don't know. Because like I say, there was a big population around here, see.

RM: Yeah, uh-huh. Now, how did you--maybe tell us a little about how you got into the…into the baking business.

JG: Well, me? Well, the reason I got into--I was going to school already. I used to help in the shop already at that time, see. My biggest job before. Then when I graduated, well, I took over the…the route, see. I delivered the bread, see, and I used to work part-time in the shop there. Okay. [phone rings] In the meantime, we had a baker working for us. He stayed a couple of years and then he quit, see. So, well, I learned just by watching and--you know what I mean--how everything was done, see. Then in later years, when I finally had to take over--that was when I took it over in [19]45, see.

Transcript at 9 minutes and 0 seconds: (09:00)

RM: So did your father retire at that time?

JG: Well, no, he—well, yeah. I bought the business from them in [19]45. He used to come over and work, but his legs were real bad, see, and then he was getting up in years, too.

UMS: He died in [19]51 (??), didn’t he?

JG: He died in--I don't know. [19]50, [19]51, I guess. Somewhere around there, yeah. Yeah.

RM: And so then, did you--then you continued after [19]45?

JG: Well, then I kept it up, see. Yeah.

Transcript at 9 minutes and 28 seconds: (9:28)

RM: Now, how big was your business, say when it was at its peak?

JG: Oh, we had a pretty good business. Well, you see, when I took it over then in 40 (??) years, well, just starting off in business, I used to bake it and bring it, see. See, I'd deliver in the morning, see. Maybe I'd get up at 6 o'clock in the morning, load up my truck, and then maybe I'd deliver till maybe 12, or maybe 12, between 12 and 1, and I'd come home, and I'd mix my doughs, see. And then while my dough was raising, I had a couple of hours or so, why, I used to take a little cat nap, see. Then I used to start, when everything--when the doughs were all ready, then we'd start making the bread, see. I had my wife helping me, and then when the kids got a little bit older, they helped a little bit too, see. But then I used to put in, what, say 6 in the morning, sometimes I never got through till after midnight. [laughs]

RM: Now, how much bread would you--or, well, before we get into that, when did you--were you making it by hand then, when you started?

JG: Well, when I took over the business from my dad, all he had…all he had was just a mixer, see. And then, they finally got a small slicer to slice the bread, but it was all hand work. Had to scale it all by hand and roll up by hand, make the bread by hand, you know what I mean. So like I say, it was mostly done all by hand. So then back in [19]57, I had the fire, see. That's when I installed that there new oven, see, and I got a little bit of extra equipment. I got a bread molder, bun cutter, and, you know, all different things that made it a little bit more easier, see. Actually, the only thing we didn't--when I had it--was scale by hand, see. But the rest was all done by machine.

Transcript at 11 minutes and 28 seconds: (11:28)

RM: Could you just kind of briefly go through the process of making bread?

JG: You mean mixing the dough into bread?

RM: What the process would be.

JG: Well, yeah. Well, first, you got--it all depends on how big of a batch you had. You figure how much you're going to make, if you're going to make 100 pounds or 200 pounds or 300 pounds. It all depends, see. So well, you put in your flour, and then you scale off your sugar, salt, all your ingredients, and shortening and stuff like that. Well, then you throw that in, see. Then, you put your yeast. The yeast would have to be put in a separate pail of water because you couldn't have too hot water or too cold, see. That had to be dissolved separate, see, and your sugar and salt would have to be dissolved in water, too. So, I had two pails, one for yeast and one for salt and sugar. So then, I used to throw it in. And after I had all the flour and everything in the mixer, well, then I just knew how much amount of water I needed. If I was gonna use maybe four or five pails, well, then I'd put in four or five pails, see. Then after I had the right amount of water in, then I'd turn my mixer on, leave it running for a couple--a little while, and then I'd throw my yeast in, put the water in, see. Then, you'd mix it up for a certain amount of time, and it all depends if you put it--I had a mixer with two speeds, low speed and high speed, see. I'd start it off in low speed first. Then, I'd hit it in high speed and leave it running for about ten minutes till the dough was all well developed, you know what I mean? You couldn't run it too long at high speed ‘cause it’s too much friction. Your dough would overheat, see. Your dough, by right--well, like in the summer--in the winter like this, if it comes out about 80 degrees, that isn't bad, see. In the summer, I used to take a little cooler because, you know, hot weather, maybe used to come out about 78, 77 see.

Transcript at 13 minutes and 33 seconds: (13:33)

RM: Now, this is just the heat from the thing being mixed.

JG: Yeah, and then after it was mixed, we had to use a big long dough trough and just used to roll it down, but throw it in front of the mixer, crack the mixture down in the bowl, and then I'd give the button a couple of pushes, and then the blade would go around and just put the bread in the dough troughs, see. And just leave it there, leave it stand there for a certain amount of time, maybe for a couple of hours. Then, you'd push it down and wait a little bit. And then after that, it was ready. Pull it up, scale it up, and start making your bread.

Transcript at 14 minutes and 14 seconds: (14:14)

RM: Now, by scaling, you mean make the loaves?

JG: Yeah. Well, they had to be a certain weight, certain weight, you see. If you were gonna make a pound loaf, well, then you'd scale a pound and four ounces. You see, in the process of making and baking, your bread would lose four ounces. So, you actual--to get exactly a pound, you had to scale it four ounces more.

RM: I see. And then the… And then how long would you bake the bread for something like that? An average, you know, typical.

JG: Oh, about 35, 40 minutes. It all depends what type of bread you got. Now see, the Italian bread, it cooks a little bit slower, see. Maybe 35, 40 minutes is about the limit. And your fat pan bread, well that's a little richer dough. It cooks a little bit faster.

RM: Now, did you make just Italian bread, or did you make other?

JG: No, we made Italian bread, and we made white sliced bread. We made rye, whole wheat, and then we then we used to make hard rolls.

Unknown Female Speaker (UFS): We don’t have… We don’t have… We don't have too many pictures, but this is John with one of the old trucks they used to have, and here's his dad, and here's one of the old trucks they had with his father and all his friends.

Transcript at 15 minutes and 39 seconds: (15:39)

JG: Can't you find the one with the Model T?

UFS: Yeah, that's the only one, but it only shows the rear end of it.

JG: No, there was supposed to be a picture with the Model T parked in front of the old garage there, you know, and that's the Model A.

UFS: Well, these are all—well, this is John in the new bak--you know.

JG: That's probably in there someplace. They ain't got so damn many pictures of that.

UFS: I don't know. Grandma had… Grandma had a couple more books. We don't know--I don’t know what she did with them. That's the whole bunch, Gaspardos and Vigandos [phonetic spellings] and Jimmy.

UMS: Jimmy, he worked there first, didn’t he?

JG: Yeah, he worked there.

RM: This is everybody who worked there?

UFS: No. Those are their wives, too. There's Jedda and there's Vapigando and there's Vespillo, Vespasana. [all phonetic spellings]

JG: No, in that picture.

UFS: And this is Jedda.

JG: That picture about the Model T should be--because I know. I was there--but it was going like this.

UFS: Oh, that little one?

JG: Yeah.

UFS: Oh, I didn’t pull that little one. [laughs] Now, I got to go to the… [inaudible crosstalk]

JG: I was nearly… I was only about 10 years old.

RM: Oh.

JG: 10 years old there, to take a picture.

RM: Okay. So this—now, can I borrow these?

JG: Well, yeah, if you want to borrow them, …

RM: Make copies and then return them.

JG: …and then you can bring them.

Recording note: [break in tape]

Transcript at 16 minutes and 51 seconds: (16:51)

JG: Number, what, 820?

UFS: I don't know what y'all got there.

JG: That's in the process of scaling up the ingredients. Salt, sugar, probably shortening. That's about it, and that, that's dry ingredients.

RM: Okay.

JG: Where's the one where he shows where he's putting the flour in? There's supposed to be a picture of that.

UFS: We didn’t get that.

JG: Putting the flour in a mixer.

UFS: You want to take that.

RM: [says something inaudible]

JG: See, that's where he's putting the flour in a mixer, see? And then this is where he's putting that in the water. See? This by rights should go first.

RM: Okay.

JG: Flour goes in first, see? Then this is where he's scaling out the dry ingredients on this one here.

RM: Oh, I see. Okay.

JG: You want the number on these or what?

RM: Yeah, I got them.

JG: You got this one here?

RM: Okay.

JG: This is the first process.

RM: Okay.

JG: A17.

RM: A17. Right.

JG: And then A20 is the second process where he's scaling off his sugar, …

RM: Okay.

JG: …shortening and that, and then you don't show where he's putting the yeast in, but this one here is showing where he's putting his water in.

RM: Okay.

JG: That's A19. This one here.

RM: Okay. And then--

JG: Now, where's that one? They ain’t got no picture scaling the dough.

UFS: No, they must have been doing it.

JG: Where's the one coming through the molder?

UFS: You ain’t got that one.

JG: Well, I thought he was just looking at it just a while ago.

UFS: Yeah, I know, but there's no bread coming out there. They must have been making it when he came. Here's where he's cutting buns. Yeah. See, he must have came after.

JG: He must have come up late in the afternoon, see?

UFS: That's what he did.

RM: So then, the next--so then, it would go through the…

JG: So then, the next one would be this one here, see?

Transcript at 18 minutes and 47 seconds: (18:47)

RM: Okay, now what's he doing there?

JG: Well, that’s--the bread is already molded there, and it's being put on the boards to raise.

RM: Okay.

JG: See?

UFS: These two things, those are flour sacks, the ones that we used to put on.

JG: Oh.

RM: Okay. Well, what’s the next?

JG: These two pictures probably would be the same process after it's raised. It's being put in the oven, see?

RM: Okay.

JG: Where's that one of Ronnie (??) taking it out of the oven?

UFS: Oh, he's got one of you there, too.

JG: Well, this is the process after it's all baked on the rack, see? [phone rings] But he's supposed to have a picture right here. Somebody's taken it out.

RM: Okay, well, this'll be… Yeah, this'll be it. And then, this is the finished product here.

JG: And that's it. And then, it shows where she's slicing it, if you want to take that one, too.

RM: No, I think we'll just go with these. So, this stage--this process was the same process your father used except you had more machinery and stuff.

JG: Well, I had a little bit more equipment. More up-to-date.

RM: But it was basically the same.

JG: But I mean, as far as the recipe and that, well, that was…there's hardly any change at all, see. Very little. We use always the same ingredients Same formula.

RM: Mm-hm. Mm-hm.

UMS: No preservatives.

JG: Huh?

UMS: No preservatives.

JG: No. No. No. We didn't believe in using it.

RM: Okay.

UFS: Do you want this? [inaudible phrase]

UMS: Used to get crumbs.

UFS: Eight cents.

UMS: Eight cents.

UFS: Buns, buns were only twenty-five…twenty…twenty cents a dozen.

JG: I think it was ten cents. I remember when I used to sell for five cents a loaf. That's when my dad had the business. But then for what? For… Then for a barrel of flour, they could have got it for a couple dollars.

UFS: Then we ended up paying sixteen, seventeen-eighty, wasn’t it?

JG: And in the end, their flour was as high as what? Fifteen dollars a hundred-pound bag?

UFS: This one here used to deliver. You don't know him either? Hi, bud.

JG: He had a farm down there, and then he moved to Illinois.

Transcript at 21 minutes and 13 seconds: (21:13)

RM: Now, what was his name?

JG: Huh?

RM: What was his name?

JG: Well, they both had the same name. I don't know how come.

UFS: One is a G and the other is a J.

JG: They used to spell theirs with a J instead of a G, see? My dad was spelled with a G. And theirs was diff--unless they were distant cousins, I don't know. In those days, you never know [laughs] what the hell they did.

RM: You know, usually you'd have a whole town. Everybody in the town would have the same name.

UFS: Oh, Mike? (??) Did you look at those pictures? This is my cottage before the grass, and here's where all those trees fell down with that big storm we had.

RM: So, he came up, and so your… [pause] What would that be, your grandfather? No. Yeah.

JG: Yeah. What year he came up here, I don’t know.

RM: But he was up farming?

JG: Yeah, he had a farm up there.

UMS: On your mother's side. On your mother’s side.

JG: Huh? Yeah. Yeah.

UMS: On Lake Annie Road somewhere.

JG: On Lake Annie Road down there.

RM: Oh. And what did he grow?

JG: Well, I don't know. I don't know if he had cows or what.

UMS: He probably had dairy cows.

JG: Just like the rest of them that was around here. That's all they had was dairy, you know.

Transcript at 22 minutes and 18 seconds: (22:18)

RM: Now, did you… Could you talk about, you know, … [inaudible crosstalk]

JG: And then, there was no big potato farmers.

UFS: There was nothing there, hey. You don't want this one or this one.

JG: Potatoes and stuff, whatever they needed for winter.

UMS: I think there was. How about Griselado's [phonetic spelling] farm? That was a farm, wasn’t it? Griselado’s? [inaudible crosstalk]

UFS: See, these are the same, and that—see, here’s another one of the Italian relatives, families. Better hold onto this. Yeah, take a knife and get that out if you can.

RM: No, no, no. I can't.

UFS: Well, cut it out because I'm taking them all out anyway.

RM: I just took it out this way.

UFS: Yeah.

RM: Because I think it's…

JG: Well, that's okay. It don’t make any difference.

UFS: Here's a picnic with the Geddas. All the family here.

RM: Mm-hm.

UFS: And, oh, that’s… That's… I don't know who it is. I can't see. Whoever the hell that monkey there…

Transcript at 23 minutes and 10 seconds: (23:10)

UMS: Do you have a bocce ball diamond here too?

JG: No. Where they used to play a lot of bocce ball was up in Canada.

UMS: Oh, yeah. Did you ever get any pictures of those guys up there playing their bocce balls?

UFS: These are a lot of picnics in here. I don’t know where the hell…

JG: So, there wasn’t much bocce ball here, I guess.

UFS: Yeah, they played bocce ball there up at the farm.

JG: [inaudible crosstalk] And then they used to go up to Gaspardo's [phonetic spelling] a lot of times and play bocce balls up there.

Transcript at 23 minutes and 29 seconds: (23:29)

RM: Now, wait a minute. In this—now, who's in this picture?

UFS: Wait, I'll look it now. There's Gedda.

RM: No, name them left from--left to right.

UFS: [inaudible word] Do you know any of those men? I don’t know any of those. [laughs] Yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know what happened to all those pictures with Grandma.

JG: Yeah, my eyes are bad, too.

UFS: Take that spyglass there.

JG: I know there's my dad there. Is that George Begando [phonetic spelling] there?

UFS: In the middle?

JG: The first one.

UFS: I don't know.

JG: Yeah, I think that's George Begando.

UFS: Was he that large?

JG: Then [pause] who's that second one there? I can't make him out.

UFS: Now, here's Gedda too, see?

JG: I can't make that second one out.

UFS: I never had that picture. Where the hell are all those bloody picnic pictures we had? Why didn't you whistle you were coming? I would have had them all ready for you. Oh, those are two digit (??). They were on a honeymoon. I put them upstairs in the attic, and they came (??). Look at that. It's a shame. That's Madeline. She's dead. John's older sister. They're all dead. I don't know. All those nice picnics we used to have. Where the hell are they? So many of them. I got to get rid of these pictures. I didn't get through. I got one book of Buzzy and his kids, got Buzzy and all them. I'm sorting them out. I want to look at them.

Recording note: [cut in tape]

UFS: The only Italian people you had were your mother and dad and Nancy and Zebra and Mrs. Sukar [phonetic spelling] down across the street.

UMS: There was just us. There was only a couple of families here. The rest were all Finns or some were Cousin Jacks [Cornish], maybe a couple of Swedes.

UFS: Swedes, English.

RM: And then the Italians were down at the bottom of the hill in the West End.

JG: On the West End over there, yeah. But they used to call it Narbonne [phonetic spelling]. Mike knows where that is. Then there used to be a lot of Italian people up in Calumet. They used to work in the mines. Mohawk, south of Painesdale, Iron Mountain, South Range.

Transcript at 25 minutes and 46 seconds: (25:46)

RM: Was there ever any kind of an Italian Hall down here?

JG: No, just in Calumet.

RM: Calumet. They never put one up around here?

JG: No, no. They used to have a hall, but that's the one they used to call the Lincoln Hall.

UMS: Yeah.

JG: Yeah. Like the Italian society, if they ever had a meeting, like they used to use that, see.

RM: Did that belong to them or that was just…?

JG: No, no, that belonged to...

UMS: It was the Germania Hall to begin with.

JG: Yeah, yeah.

UMS: After World War I, they changed it to Lincoln Hall.

JG: Yeah, I don't know who bought it then.

UMS: I don’t--it burned down, hey.

JG: Yeah, and then part of it burned down.

UFS: [inaudible crosstalk] They made us a gener—a family picture. Have you ever seen one? I got a picture of the bakery on there. The outside of it, but it's in the winter. I don't know where that went either.

RM: Well, this is good.

Recording note: [cut in tape]

Transcript at 26 minutes and 34 seconds: (26:34)

JG: Right next to their shop when my dad had it, he had--used to have the horse barn there. He used to keep horses in it.

UFS: Yeah.

JG: He used to raise a couple of pigs.

UFS: Chickens and rabbits.

JG: [inaudible crosstalk] Chickens. Upstairs in the barn, he used to raise rabbits.

UFS: Then they put it down on the car and moved all the cows.

UMS: And out in the back here, there used to be bins. There used to be one here, had a barn here with cows. They used--their cows used to run them across the road there, up on a hill there to feed them. There used to be another one on the corner. Hell, I don't know how many people they had milk cows here.

JG: [says something inaudible]

UFS: If there was any more pictures, maybe…maybe George or Isabel got them because I know Grandma had more than that.

RM: Those are good.

UFS: Those are left now. I think they took the ones they...

JG: Yeah.

RM: Now, this is...

JG: There used to be quite a few Italian people up on the hill up over there too, you know.

UMS: How many belonged to the church? 56 families belong to the church.

JG: Yeah.

RM: Mm-hm.

Recording note: [cut in tape]

Transcript at 27 minutes and 39 seconds: (27:39)

JG: You'd have to split the son of a bitches.

RM: Now--

JG: Especially in the winter.

RM: Now, where did… Where did…

JG: Dig them out of the snow. But them buggers used--you know, when they were frozen--used to split easy.

RM: Now, where did your father buy the wood then?

JG: He used to buy some from Cappo [phonetic spelling] up there. His--what you call it. Wherever he could get it. Wherever he got… [inaudible crosstalk]

RM: Yeah. But Cappo sold firewood as well.

JG: Well, yeah. Well, I mean, he used to buy it, you know, for the oven here now. In fact, if he sold firewood to anybody else, I don't know.

RM: Yeah.

JG: But then, that's all people used to burn in those days.

UFS: Yeah, he used to use some log, oh, about pretty around. He used to split them.

JG: I used to bitch at the ones that had the bloody knots. [laughs] That was my job every day after school.

UFS: No, they used to use them four foot long. They used to just split them. Then the fire, the flame would come out.

UMS: Yeah. They had to be bone dry too, eh?

JG: Huh?

UMS: They had to be dry.

UFS: [inaudible crosstalk] …about bread instead of putting a [inaudible word] on the bed…

JG: Well, yeah. I used to throw them in and used to put them there in front of the oven. [inaudible crosstalk]

UFS: …and wet the bread. Slide a rag, wet rag over the bread, hey Dad? [phone rings]

JG: Some days the oven would still be hot, yet he'd take some, and he'd split some real small, see. He used take those and shove them in the firebox. They'd dry off real good, see.

UMS: You couldn’t use maple? You couldn't use fire. (??)

JG: No, no, no. [inaudible word] Mostly all hardwood.

UFS: That was Lester. No, he isn't here right now.

Recording note: [tape ends]